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Posted by Johnny 99 on 04-5-2006 4:15 AM
numberonemusic.com a scam?

I'm wondering about numberonemusic.com and if it's a scam. For doing nothing, we seem to be getting an awful lot of daily plays. For the "Last 7 Days" charts we've taken over Southern Rock (our songs are placed #1, 2 and 3) and we've broken the top 30 on the Alt-Country charts.

In the 2 weeks we've been on there, we have a total of over 800 plays. Compare that to myspace where we are actively advertising the band, and it took us a few months to get to 800 plays.

I've checked out a handful of the email addresses from the "people" who sign up on there to be on our mailing list, and some seem legit. But the majority of them seem like they're coming off of websites that aren't legitimate.

I just don't buy the numbers on n1m.com. I think that they are overinflating our egos during the 30 day trial period to get us to fork over money to them. I wonder if we payed for continued service if the numbers would be the same. Hmmm. Just out of curiosity (and the idea to expose wrongdoers) I might pay for a couple of months just to see what happens.

Who else is on that site? Have you noticed anything weird? Have you been looking for anything weird?
Posted by kilterr on 04-5-2006 12:09 PM
We signed up for the free trial too on the recommendation of someone in PR. We saw a load of plays too although nothing on the scale you're talking.. While it's free I'd say run with it.. Our trial is over now but the profile stays there and still getting plays.. Just had a look there, the 3 songs we have up there are on over 2000 plays each... Seems a bit suspicious seeing as when we signed up there we didn't do any promotion of it.
Posted by Andrew Hignett on 04-5-2006 12:16 PM
The whole thing about number of plays etc. is one of many reasons I don't have a lot of faith in internet statistics in general. 2000 plays, 2000 profile views, 2000 friends on Myspace, 2000 votes... it could mean something positive or it could just as easily be bollocks. Personally, I'd never bother quoting internet statistics in any of my band's promotional texts ie. biogs, press packs etc. I can't see them holding much water with anyone in the know.
Posted by kilterr on 04-5-2006 1:21 PM
Quote:

Originally posted by -:Sheldon:-

The whole thing about number of plays etc. is one of many reasons I don't have a lot of faith in internet statistics in general. 2000 plays, 2000 profile views, 2000 friends on Myspace, 2000 votes... it could mean something positive or it could just as easily be bollocks. Personally, I'd never bother quoting internet statistics in any of my band's promotional texts ie. biogs, press packs etc. I can't see them holding much water with anyone in the know.


Yep, I'd agree here.. Unless it's a reputable website.
Posted by UKB Office on 04-5-2006 1:28 PM
if you got the email address for each one then it's great, if you don't have any contact details then it is pointless.

how many messages have you had, thats what you should look at..
Posted by Katie McGowan on 04-5-2006 1:45 PM
i like it Smile

not had any complaints from emails we've sent out so far via the site and have a nice american mailing list on the build Smile
Posted by Johnny 99 on 04-5-2006 2:54 PM
Quote:

Originally posted by ADMIN

if you got the email address for each one then it's great, if you don't have any contact details then it is pointless.

how many messages have you had, thats what you should look at..


We've got 48 emails signed up on our newsletter list. How many of those go to real people, I'm not sure. Some are legit hotmail and yahoo type accounts. Most are random.

If it's all real, then cool. I'm just skeptical that for no personal effort we've received that much publicity.
Posted by Johnny 99 on 04-5-2006 2:58 PM
Quote:

Originally posted by kilterr

We signed up for the free trial too on the recommendation of someone in PR. We saw a load of plays too although nothing on the scale you're talking.. While it's free I'd say run with it.. Our trial is over now but the profile stays there and still getting plays.. Just had a look there, the 3 songs we have up there are on over 2000 plays each... Seems a bit suspicious seeing as when we signed up there we didn't do any promotion of it.


With your trial period being over, can you still log in and get the email addresses of people who sign up for your newsletter?
Posted by Katie McGowan on 04-5-2006 2:59 PM
Number1 music is ran by a marketing company, i imagine they send out lists with new bands on to the music fans/street-teams they know of.

The plays did worry me a little but I'm relatively happy with the email addresses. I'm tempted to upgrade after the trial.
Posted by Andrew Hignett on 04-5-2006 3:07 PM
I think I understand this now. Sounds very very very much like a scam. 2000 plays without even half trying?
I'm not buying that one.
Unless your getting any replies to the emails you send out it's difficult to know if any of them are legit... and even then, you can't really be sure.
Posted by Katie McGowan on 04-5-2006 3:14 PM
But you don't just get an email you get name, country, city, zipcode too. Seems a lot of info for people to go to the trouble to fake!

The site has accounts for listeners as well as bands (like UKbands) so surfers are encouraged to hang around and take a listen to the bands.

There's also a mailing list you can plug yourself on - you can choose it to go out to a certain genre. I plugged Submerse out to the punk list and we've had some great responses even gigs offers.

It's just a shame you've got to pay after 30 days!
Posted by Andrew Hignett on 04-5-2006 3:31 PM
Quote:

Originally posted by Katie McGowan

But you don't just get an email you get name, country, city, zipcode too. Seems a lot of info for people to go to the trouble to fake!

The site has accounts for listeners as well as bands (like UKbands) so surfers are encouraged to hang around and take a listen to the bands.

There's also a mailing list you can plug yourself on - you can choose it to go out to a certain genre. I plugged Submerse out to the punk list and we've had some great responses even gigs offers.

It's just a shame you've got to pay after 30 days!


Still seems very dubious to me. I mean it's not that hard to fake names, countries, cities, zipcodes etc. You have to input those every time you set up an email anyway.

I could be wrong of course and I don't mind being proved wrong, but this whole 2000 plays thing just seems ridiculous. I am very wary of internet statistics.
Posted by Mighty Bullo Pill on 04-5-2006 4:09 PM
Is it a well marketed site stateside?
Posted by Johnny 99 on 04-5-2006 5:23 PM
Quote:

Originally posted by Mighty Bullo Pill

Is it a well marketed site stateside?


I don't think so. The only reason I know about it is because someone mentioned it on a thread here at ukbands.
Posted by Johnny 99 on 04-5-2006 5:25 PM
Quote:

Originally posted by -:Sheldon:-



Still seems very dubious to me. I mean it's not that hard to fake names, countries, cities, zipcodes etc. You have to input those every time you set up an email anyway.

I could be wrong of course and I don't mind being proved wrong, but this whole 2000 plays thing just seems ridiculous. I am very wary of internet statistics.



Once our 30 day trial period is up, I'm going to take all the email addresses from our mailing list on there and send out a message from johnny99.com asking everyone to respond. I'll take some stats as to those who respond, and see what we come up with.
Posted by Stairway on 05-5-2006 8:56 AM
We signed up over a year ago for the 30 day trial, and got a few email addresses.

Johnny 99:
No, after the 30 day period, you can not access any of the email addresses, so I suggest you put them in your address book if you don't intend to go further.
---------

I, after much deliberation, decided to give it a try for 6 months and see what happens. Had a least two 'sign ups' ever day so far, and as Kate says, building up a nice list of mostly US names, and the good thing is, it would seem, if you send out a newsletter from the site it goes to all the signees with your bands email address attached; I sent out our latest newsletter in this way, and so far have received over 20 replies from signees to the bands email address and not via N1M.
Will have to see now whether we can turn this 'interest' into album sales....that will be the real test. We only have to sell 2 CDs via this to recoup the subs money!!

Ultimately, you have to weigh up potential gain from being ripped off!!

Graeme.
Posted by The Gandhiband on 05-5-2006 12:17 PM
Just signed up for a piece of this action!

A slightly related question, we're looking to develop our mailing list (more or less from scratch). Does anyone know how you go about adding a "sign up" button on your myspace account?
Posted by Katie McGowan on 05-5-2006 12:33 PM
it would depend on the email collection software that you use
Posted by kilterr on 05-5-2006 1:30 PM
When we signed up, everytime someone signed up to the mailing list it also sent a request email to our registered email address so as each req came in I also added them to my outlook address book (with news as their first name) and still use all the addresses for our mailing list. Handy enough. Usually get one or 2 bounces but otherwise it all seems to work fine..
Posted by Stairway on 05-5-2006 1:35 PM
Gandhiband,
reference myspace/sign up button, we use Bravenet. All you do is copy and paste the code into the 'Sounds Like' section on your myspace, and it should appear.

See our site for an idea what it looks like.
www.myspace.com/stairway

Graeme.
Posted by Beneva on 05-5-2006 1:49 PM
The new UK bands site is supposed to allow people to sign up to your mailing lists...
Posted by The Gandhiband on 05-5-2006 3:33 PM
Quote:

Originally posted by Stairway

Gandhiband,
reference myspace/sign up button, we use Bravenet. All you do is copy and paste the code into the 'Sounds Like' section on your myspace, and it should appear.

See our site for an idea what it looks like.
www.myspace.com/stairway

Graeme.


Cheers Graeme. We'll give it a shot.

Dan
Posted by Johnny 99 on 05-5-2006 4:41 PM
Quote:

Originally posted by Stairway

We signed up over a year ago for the 30 day trial, and got a few email addresses.

Johnny 99:
No, after the 30 day period, you can not access any of the email addresses, so I suggest you put them in your address book if you don't intend to go further.
---------

I, after much deliberation, decided to give it a try for 6 months and see what happens. Had a least two 'sign ups' ever day so far, and as Kate says, building up a nice list of mostly US names, and the good thing is, it would seem, if you send out a newsletter from the site it goes to all the signees with your bands email address attached; I sent out our latest newsletter in this way, and so far have received over 20 replies from signees to the bands email address and not via N1M.
Will have to see now whether we can turn this 'interest' into album sales....that will be the real test. We only have to sell 2 CDs via this to recoup the subs money!!

Ultimately, you have to weigh up potential gain from being ripped off!!

Graeme.


Cool. That's good news that you're receiving emails - and not through the site. That makes me feel a little less skeptical. I'm probably going to go ahead and pay for the service. Right now we're pulling in an average of about 5 emails per day. That's 150 people per month. If 5% of our fans buy a CD that's 7-8 per month. That would more than pay for the service. Not bad.
Posted by Andrew Hignett on 05-5-2006 5:24 PM
Quote:

Originally posted by Johnny 99



Cool. That's good news that you're receiving emails - and not through the site. That makes me feel a little less skeptical. I'm probably going to go ahead and pay for the service. Right now we're pulling in an average of about 5 emails per day. That's 150 people per month. If 5% of our fans buy a CD that's 7-8 per month. That would more than pay for the service. Not bad.


Let us know how you get on with your sales.
I remain skeptical of this, but if bands who are using it start shifting a lot of units I might look into it a bit more.
Posted by Stairway on 05-5-2006 6:18 PM
I'll keep you all posted on any sales developments.

Graeme.
Posted by Stairway on 05-5-2006 6:24 PM
Another interesting feature if you sign up for full membership, is, you get a 'merchandise store' where you can sell you albums and merch etc.......the best thing is, when you click on the item, it goes directly (in our case) to our website sales page, not through a subsidiary. So no sharing of revenue.

Graeme.
Posted by Johnny 99 on 05-5-2006 6:34 PM
Right on, Graeme. Thanks.
Posted by Stairway on 05-5-2006 6:39 PM
I've just gone on to our N1M page, interestingly, I signed up for full membership on Tuesday, so only been 'live' for a couple of days.
Total plays was stagnant at 7000 plays
Page views stagnant at 19000
Now after 2 days:
Plays10,000+
Page views26770.
Food for thought??

Graeme.
Posted by Andrew Hignett on 05-5-2006 6:46 PM
Quote:

Originally posted by Stairway

Another interesting feature if you sign up for full membership, is, you get a 'merchandise store' where you can sell you albums and merch etc.......the best thing is, when you click on the item, it goes directly (in our case) to our website sales page, not through a subsidiary. So no sharing of revenue.

Graeme.


I think that's another feature the new UKbands site will have, but for free.
Posted by Comeg on 06-5-2006 8:21 AM
I sent off a lot of emails to the people who supposedly joined our mailing list when we were in the free trial period and the majority of them bounced.

I still occaisionally receive emails telling me someone has joined my mailing list and if I were a paying member I would be able to access them.

There are so many free sites out there it seems ridiculous to pay.

Wendy Altea
Posted by Johnny 99 on 06-5-2006 4:33 PM
Quote:

Originally posted by Comeg

I sent off a lot of emails to the people who supposedly joined our mailing list when we were in the free trial period and the majority of them bounced.

I still occaisionally receive emails telling me someone has joined my mailing list and if I were a paying member I would be able to access them.

There are so many free sites out there it seems ridiculous to pay.

Wendy Altea



Do you have any idea what percentage of them bounced back? 10? 20? 50?

The reason why this site is attractive to me over other free sites is that, in theory, they are a promotions company. They put your music out there to the people who would like to hear it. I only have so much time during the day to dedicate to promoting the band. If, for a minimal fee, I can get someone else to do that then it's worth it. I increase the number of potential fans I can contact. The free sites don't do promotion for you, they are just tools for you to use in your personal promotion activities.
Posted by Comeg on 06-5-2006 5:09 PM
Out of about 50 emails 40 bounced. The ones that didn't I never heard back from. Can't be specific as it was a while ago. I've just had a look now and we are on total plays 10570.

I do all COMEG's promotion so I don't need to pay anyone to do it for me. I disagree about free sites not promoting bands. I have received several emails and comments as well as sales from people who saw COMEG on a free site. A lot of these free sites have their own podcasts as well as their own forums for bands to promote themselves. They choose different bands every month as "Featured Artist" Just being on them is a form of promotion in itself surely? For example if I type COMEG into google my homepage is at the top yet my profile on this page is the third one down. I don't pay anything to be a member on this site yet I would call that promotion wouldn't you?

I have not and never will pay an unsigned site to promote COMEG as I don't see what they can do that I can't.



We were featured in a podcast last night and on the strength of that, we have had 25 visitors last night and 20 today (I have a statcounter which allows me to access how many people come to the site, how long they stayed and where they came from ) as well as a request for an interview from another Podcaster who also wants to feature COMEG on his show as well as a couple of emails from people who told us how much they liked our music.

Didn't cost me a penny.

Take care

Wendy Altea
Posted by Johnny 99 on 06-5-2006 5:56 PM
Wow! 80% bounced back. That's not good news.

Here's my take on paying for promotions. You can only do so much every day before you reach max capacity. If you're satisfied with maintaining your growing fan base at that rate, then cool. But, if you're looking for even greater growth, you need to look into additional avenues for promotion.

A band is like any other business. You grow the business to the point of maximum capacity at your current employee level. If you want to grow more you have to hire more employees and open up another store front. Once you are at the maximum capacity for doing promotion, if you want more on top of that you are going to have to hire someone to do that additional promotion. That's all I'm trying to do with number1music. I'm at max capacity, but I want the band to grow more, faster, so I'm investigating various promotional opportunities.

As far as free site promoting bands, maybe I was too general when I said they don't promote. Of course they do. And they do their best. But it all boils down to the fact that you get what you pay for. Ultimately nothing is free.
Posted by Stairway on 12-5-2006 5:17 PM
A bit of an update.
We have sold 3 CDs this week. It's a bit difficult to know whether they came thro' from N1M, but as it was directly from our site, I guess it might have been.
2 from Cyprus and 1 from Greece.
In any case it has paid for the 6 month subscription.

Best
Graeme.
Posted by Johnny 99 on 12-5-2006 6:19 PM
Thanks for the update!

We've been riding high on the charts - and I finally figured out why. Our competition for our music category "Southern Rock" is very limited. Several of the bands don't even have any songs posted. So, if users ever go on to look for Southern Rock, we're pretty much the number one band on there.

It's good to be in a niche genre. Headbang
Posted by Andrew Hignett on 12-5-2006 6:26 PM
While I remain open minded about this, it does have the ring of scam about it.
As far as I'm aware, UKbands will be offering the same service for free in the not too distant future.

As for charts and all that... I am very sceptical of internet statistics.
Posted by Johnny 99 on 22-5-2006 6:06 AM
Okay, our 1 month trial is over so I sent out an email from our johnny99.com account to all of the fans. I asked them to respond and let us know that we had successfully added them to the list. Now I'll just sit back and wait. Only 4 out of the 85 addresses I sent to bounced so far, but we'll see what it looks like tomorrow when I wake up.

We'll get to the bottom of this!
Posted by Johnny 99 on 29-5-2006 4:54 AM
And here is the final report. Exactly one week ago I sent a message to 85 of the emails that were on our fan list on numberonemusic.com. The message was this:


<beginning of message>

Just a quick message to say hello and acknowledge that you submitted your email address on NumberOneMusic.com to our newsletter list.

We're just getting our feet wet on Number One Music, and as such we don't have a lot of information on there yet. If you want all of the latest news, photos, downloads, merchandise, etc, please visit the band website or our myspace site:

www.johnny99.com
www.myspace.com/johnny99theband

We are currently preparing for our mini tour of the UK this summer. It's going to be loads of fun. The dates are posted on myspace. So, if you're in the UK or N. Ireland come and see one of the shows!

Hey, and as a small favor, if you could just hit the "reply" button to this message and let us know that you received it that would be great. We're trying to verify that all of these email address are good ones and that we aren't spamming anyone. If you didn't put your email on our list, please reply and let me know and I'll remove you from the list.

Keep on rockin,
Johnny 99

<end of message>


Of the 85 emails I sent out, 4 failed with various delivery errors. Out of the remaining 81 that went to valid email address, I received NO replies. I would have expected at least a couple of replies, but none? Come on! So, I have come to the conclusion that Number1Music should change its name to Number1Scam. Don't waste your money.
Posted by Andrew Hignett on 29-5-2006 8:02 AM
Sounds like a scam to me.
I s'pose you could keep all those email addresses on your mailing list and keep mailing them all on the off chance that their are actually real people on the other end of them, but it sounds like they're all fake. Wouldn't hurt to keep mailing them though, so long as you don't pin your hopes on getting responses.
Posted by UKB Office on 29-5-2006 9:41 AM
a load of empty mail booxes and hardly real people who have asked to be included in your bands mail list, I think some investigation by watchdog is in order, that is if the co is in the UK I've not checked.
Posted by phil09 on 01-8-2006 6:46 PM
Guitar the flip side

i've been on N1M for 11 weeks, and without getting into the numbers, have received something like 270 fan e-mail additions, all backed up at my own PC... after i hit 180 fans i sent out a promotion offering a free cd for the first 10 returns with a postal address and got back 23 replies (all of whom received the cd), no scam there, nor does the N1M site e-listing sound like much of a scam, since these came from all over, usa, europe, new zealand, etc.
i figure that most people are wary and weary of replying to e-mails, sh1t i erase over half the stuff that falls into the 3 i got, so i guess most people do the same, either way free promotion is free promotion
phil09
Posted by Andrew Hignett on 02-8-2006 7:49 AM
Quote:

Originally posted by phil09i've been on N1M for 11 weeks, and without getting into the numbers, have received something like 270 fan e-mail additions, all backed up at my own PC... after i hit 180 fans i sent out a promotion offering a free cd for the first 10 returns with a postal address and got back 23 replies (all of whom received the cd), no scam there, nor does the N1M site e-listing sound like much of a scam, since these came from all over, usa, europe, new zealand, etc.
i figure that most people are wary and weary of replying to e-mails, sh1t i erase over half the stuff that falls into the 3 i got, so i guess most people do the same, either way free promotion is free promotion
phil09


Yes, free promotion is free promotion, but then there's promotion you pay money for and that's got to be looked at a lot more closely. You've got to admit, it's a bit suspicious how bands seem to accumulate so many fan emails during their free trial period.
Posted by phil09 on 02-8-2006 8:54 PM
Quote:

Originally posted by Andy

Yes, free promotion is free promotion, but then there's promotion you pay money for and that's got to be looked at a lot more closely. You've got to admit, it's a bit suspicious how bands seem to accumulate so many fan emails during their free trial period.


If you go to the numberonemusic.org site you'll see where the people are coming from, if they've got 1,800,000 registered fans interested in new music, who are willing to take the time to stream and/or download then a couple of 'undred e-mails means you're slow
don't sit aorund waiting for a miracle get plugged in
Posted by Johnster on 02-8-2006 9:00 PM
It's weird, i signed up and posted no music and no bio whatsoever, yet we still received email fan signups. I think it has auto signups or something set on the site and adds a new one now and again, maybe a random email address that it makes up and every few are actual email addresses and it happens to go through.

Seems a bit dodgy for me, i wouldn't pay for it i know that.
Posted by Deep September on 02-8-2006 11:01 PM
The site is back up now, but all of the band images are down, and it won't let me sign up either...
Posted by Andrew Hignett on 03-8-2006 10:29 AM
Quote:

Originally posted by phil09

If you go to the numberonemusic.org site you'll see where the people are coming from, if they've got 1,800,000 registered fans interested in new music, who are willing to take the time to stream and/or download then a couple of 'undred e-mails means you're slow
don't sit aorund waiting for a miracle get plugged in


You don't think stuff like that can be faked?
I can imagine someone taking the time to do it, given the money making potential of the idea.
What Johnster has posted makes me that much more convinced of what I suspect... I could be wrong, naturally.
Posted by phil09 on 03-8-2006 1:58 PM
Quote:

Originally posted by Andy

You don't think stuff like that can be faked?
I can imagine someone taking the time to do it, given the money making potential of the idea.
What Johnster has posted makes me that much more convinced of what I suspect... I could be wrong, naturally.


if you live in a world where the moon landing was faked too, i guess anything is possible, but it would take the same effort to fake as to do what they're claiming, so why fake it????
been speaking to a number of artist/friends who are on N1M, and very few of them have negative opinions regarding this event (if that's what it is)
benefit of the doubt is given in cases when there's no evidence or the evidence could easily read for or against, and all i see are opinions not facts!!! alot of kneejerk reaction cos one band got zero replies from their 80+ fans
got anything solid with proof to back it up??? if not it's all hot air, right mate
Posted by Andrew Hignett on 03-8-2006 2:32 PM
Quote:

Originally posted by phil09

if you live in a world where the moon landing was faked too, i guess anything is possible, but it would take the same effort to fake as to do what they're claiming, so why fake it????
been speaking to a number of artist/friends who are on N1M, and very few of them have negative opinions regarding this event (if that's what it is)
benefit of the doubt is given in cases when there's no evidence or the evidence could easily read for or against, and all i see are opinions not facts!!! alot of kneejerk reaction cos one band got zero replies from their 80+ fans
got anything solid with proof to back it up??? if not it's all hot air, right mate


Well it is all naturally opinion based on information at hand. ( I did say "I could be wrong...").
I really don't think stuff like this is that difficult to fake. The internet can be a very dubious place and it can be very difficult to know if the information you receive is accurate.
Do you have any personal connection to NUmber1 Music?

Andy.
Posted by Santiago on 03-8-2006 6:28 PM
Funny thing happened with us...we signed upto this and got about 100 people signed up with email addresses. Sent out a load of emails to them...no replies. Then, a day or so later, we started to get around 30 - 40 junk emails, selling us viagra, herbal medicine, drugs, porn etc etc. Im not sure if these are connected, it could just be a coincidence...but i know we never got junk mail before we signed up for the N1M thing.
Posted by Akpcep on 10-8-2006 10:52 AM
I've gotta say,I'm 99% convinced this is a scam.

Look at your website hits - if these "fans" love your music so much, wouldn't you expect at least some of them to visit your website? We've received about 50 fan emails from n1m, and NOT ONE visit to www.akp.org.uk referred from n1m.

Obviously, they've got a script that fires out automatic mailing list signups using email addresses they've got from somewhere, or made up, in a bid to make gullible unsigned bands sign up for their subscription service. It's deplorable.

Those of you who've already signed up are bound to defend it, because you don't like to think you've been ripped off, but think about it logically. Myspace has much more traffic, and I'm sure you've all got accounts there - compare the number of plays you get there with the number of alleged plays you get from a little-known Russian website.
Posted by Andrew Hignett on 10-8-2006 11:19 AM
Quote:

Originally posted by akpcep

Those of you who've already signed up are bound to defend it, because you don't like to think you've been ripped off, but think about it logically. Myspace has much more traffic, and I'm sure you've all got accounts there - compare the number of plays you get there with the number of alleged plays you get from a little-known Russian website.


I think this pretty neatly sums up why bands will try to defend the various (alleged) scams out there. No one likes to feel they've been had and if we're all honest, we've all no doubt been had by at least one of the sharks out there.
... and indeed, if N1M really is the place to be for music fans, why have I only heard of it on this thread?
Posted by Stairway on 10-8-2006 12:02 PM
We had someone sign up to our newsletter, so I emailed them directly and this came back:

- These recipients of your message have been processed by the mail server:
(address I have removed); Failed; 5.1.1 (bad destination mailbox address)

Remote MTA sitemail.everyone.net: SMTP diagnostic: 550 Recipient Rejected: Account Inactive

I emailed N1M thus:
"As we are members of Number One Music, we expect to be given bona fide signees not ones plucked out of thin air to make it appear we have a growing mailing list of fans."

Their reply:
"We can't control your mailing list sign ups since those emails go directly to your mailbox. We have thousands of emails via our server every day and it's almost impossible to monitor them all.
If you want to discontinue our services for your account, please let us know. We do care about your satisfaction."

So there you are, go figure??!!
Any comments?

Graeme
Stairway
Posted by phil09 on 10-8-2006 2:50 PM
MySpace is self-promoted, so for those who don't have the time to network/promote for whatever reason or who ain't good at it, you get zero plays, that's social skills!
as for the ridiculous statement about money, it certainly wouldn't be the first time as a musician that i got ripped off (at least) $40, cause i didn't get paid the combined fee for a set, or some other such reason, thats just slagging off other musicians cause you get a turn on by it!!!!
whats your proof that the site is russian??? give us a legitimate trail, evidence....
my basic argument, which is is still solid, is that no-one has presented any solid proof, we got opinion, gossip, 3rd party heresay, a whole heap of crap that is unprovable either way
and since i only paid $40 (cheap, even if i eventually find out its a rip off) and i'm not convinced either way
Posted by phil09 on 10-8-2006 2:58 PM
i'm trying to figure this out as much as any one so i only get ripped off $40, if that is the case
Posted by Andrew Hignett on 10-8-2006 3:22 PM
Quote:

Originally posted by phil09MySpace is self-promoted, so for those who don't have the time to network/promote for whatever reason or who ain't good at it, you get zero plays, that's social skills!


It isn't really that hard to promote on Myspace is it? You add, you comment, you post bulletins, that's it. I find it hard to believe there are many artists outside of the big leagues who don't have time to do this.

Quote:

Originally posted by phil09
as for the ridiculous statement about money, it certainly wouldn't be the first time as a musician that i got ripped off (at least) $40, cause i didn't get paid the combined fee for a set, or some other such reason, thats just slagging off other musicians cause you get a turn on by it!!!!


Err... OK...Confused

Quote:

Originally posted by phil09
whats your proof that the site is russian??? give us a legitimate trail, evidence....
my basic argument, which is is still solid, is that no-one has presented any solid proof, we got opinion, gossip, 3rd party heresay, a whole heap of crap that is unprovable either way
and since i only paid $40 (cheap, even if i eventually find out its a rip off) and i'm not convinced either way


If it's yet to be proven then it's not a whole heap of crap is it? I think you're being overly protective here. I don't think anyone's gossiping here. There is a lot to suggest that N1M is a scam.

* It is nothing like as well known as Myspace etc. yet is apparently producing more results.
* Someone has sent a lot of emails and received bugger all results.
* The simple fact that the majority of people out there who ask you for money in the music business usually are ripping you off. There may be a small number who aren't, but the majority of networking sites for artists don't charge for the basic package.

No it's not solid proof, but it follows a basic logic.
Posted by phil09 on 10-8-2006 5:12 PM
the basic package at N1M is free, but you should check out
Exposé! No more guessing! here's the dirt!
regarding N1M....
Posted by phil09 on 10-8-2006 5:15 PM
Quote:

Originally posted by -:Sheldon:-

I think this pretty neatly sums up why bands will try to defend the various (alleged) scams out there. No one likes to feel they've been had and if we're all honest, we've all no doubt been had by at least one of the sharks out there.
... and indeed, if N1M really is the place to be for music fans, why have I only heard of it on this thread?


you should check out "Exposé! No more guessing! here's the dirt!"
regarding N1M....
Posted by Stoneman on 18-8-2006 1:31 AM
I have been following this thread and the one on CD Baby for some time now. I have been a member of numberonemusic.com for about 6 months. I was sooo happy to see all the plays and signups that it hadn't occurred to me that it was a scam. However, now I have my own proof that it is in fact a scam. In regards to them being Russian. I talked to their billing company ( 2CO.com ) and they told me that they are in fact Russian. Also, I did my own testing of which the results I will reveal to you in the next three posts. I also found a solution and a way to get all of my money back including my previous months payments. So, those of you who feel as though you have been dooped, fear not for I have the answer. Read my next three posts to find out how I came to my conclusions and solutions.

Be Blessed,

Stoneman
Posted by Stoneman on 18-8-2006 1:41 AM
So, I did a test in which I sent out two emails instructing everyone on my list to respond with the words "I Am Real" One email was sent from the Numberone music server and the other from my personal email server. The results are as follows:

Numberone music server:
First of all it took three days before I received any responses. Then they all came in at once. I thought that was strange and suspect. Out of 297 people on my list I received 136 responses and all wrote "I Am Real". However, it appeared that each response was sent in timed sequence as if someone had cut and pasted "I Am Real" on each response. There was about two minutes in between each response which also seemed suspicious. But the most suspicious thing is that they all did exactly as I instructed. People don't do that. There is always that one or two people that will get it wrong.

My Personal email server?

I didn't receive one response. Not one I tell you! Folks, I could be wrong here but something certainly seems wrong. I am releasing a new CD this week. I will come back and let you all know what happens after I announce it to the Number One Music sign ups. I have kept them on a seperate data base so it will be easy for me to judge the responses.

At this point, I suspect I have been had. Its not the first time. I have been had by several websites before. I am interested in starting a consumer report website for musicians. Anybody else interested? I'm tired of getting ripped off by people who prey on unsuspecting artists. On to the next post...............

Be Blessed,

Stoneman
Posted by Stoneman on 18-8-2006 1:43 AM
A very interesting thing happened this morning after I posted my results on CD Baby website. I went to check my web page at Numberonemusic.com and discovered that it was gone. My log on was also disabled. I paid for a full year about a month ago and now they have decided to purposely rip me off without any notice. This cements it for me!

Numberonemusic.com is a scam folks. Get the word out to every musician you know. These people are crooks. they didn't even have the decency to answer my emails about it.

Why am I not surprised? The solution comes in the very next post.

Stoneman
www.stonemanavenue.com
Posted by Stoneman on 18-8-2006 1:48 AM
I am a man of action. Are you? If so, heres what you should do about this situation.

1. If you want to get your money refunded this is what you have to do. Contact 2CO.Com (they handle numberonemusic.com's financial transactions) 1-877-294-0273 or at www.2CO.Com and ask for the fraud department. Give them your last payment transaction number and the low down on these crooks. Then request a refund. They not only refunded my latest transaction but they refunded all previous months transactions to my card.

2. Notify all your friends that have been scammed by them (as I have) and instruct them to do the same. The more people that get involved, the sooner these crooks will be out of business.

3. Post this information on all the forums that you are a member to.

4. Contact "Consumer reports Web Watch" at http://www.consumerwebwatch.org/dynamic/fraud-investigation-show-me-the-money.cfm and report this company to them. Once again, the more people that get involved, the more effective it will be.

5. Notify all musicians and professional organizations that you are involved with i.e. ASCAP, BMI, GMA, PRS etc. and ask that they notify their membership about this company.

We can sit around and wine about being ripped off or we can get busy and take these clowns down. It all depends on how important it is to you. For me, moral integrity is #1 on my list when I do business with anyone. I don't like my hard earned money being ripped off so I take action. So, what are you going to do?

Be Blessed Regardless,

Stoneman
Posted by phil09 on 18-8-2006 3:36 AM
the "Stoneman" rocks........

other evidence came to light after the "hack/crash" @ N1M (posted on a parallel thread) regarding how they send "very positive" false feedback to convince people to part with their hard earned cash...

http://www.ukbands.net/thread.php?id=13547
Posted by Akpcep on 18-8-2006 6:11 AM
Great work Stoneman - I didn't spend any money with these fools (I never pay for online services like this), but I'm glad for the other people who've been duped that you've taken action.
Posted by Andrew Hignett on 18-8-2006 9:03 AM
Good work Stoneman.
These scheisters need to be brought down asap.
Posted by phil09 on 26-8-2006 1:18 AM
Quote:

Originally posted by -:Sheldon:-Good work Stoneman.
These scheisters need to be brought down asap.


Well Sheldon, your wish came true, both numberonemusic.com and the scheisters organizational team at numberonemusic.org are both off the air and have been for 4 days.

Looks like the the Stoneman's highly informative links have begun to pay off, I even put in for my refund, but got my page yanked instead before they criminals went AWOL

then followed the Stoneman's logic and went over to Consumer reports Web Watch" at http://www.consumerwebwatch.org/dynamic/fraud-investigation-show-me-the-money.cfm and reported my case.... 
something that I would recommend even though the're off line, since they may well attempt yet another comeback
Posted by UKB Office on 26-8-2006 11:44 AM
Result... standing to cut down on the number of rip off's taking money from hopeful's can only be a good thing to clean a little muck from this industry......

how many more to go??
Posted by Johnny Proctor on 04-9-2006 4:34 PM
Hi, fellow musicians and music lovers. I'm Johnny Proctor, one of the people duped into believing the hubris on N1M. I have no idea what was real, what was fake, etc... I took Stoneman's advice and withdrew my paid subscription. Today the site came back up with everyone's stats on zero. I have no idea what is going on. Where's the intel?

Thanks,

Johnny

http://www.soundclick.com/pro/view/01/default.cfm?bandID=220644
Posted by Andrew Hignett on 04-9-2006 4:45 PM
Quote:

Originally posted by Johnny ProctorHi, fellow musicians and music lovers. I'm Johnny Proctor, one of the people duped into believing the hubris on N1M. I have no idea what was real, what was fake, etc... I took Stoneman's advice and withdrew my paid subscription. Today the site came back up with everyone's stats on zero. I have no idea what is going on. Where's the intel?

Thanks,

Johnny

http://www.soundclick.com/pro /view/01/default.cfm?bandID=220644


Have they possibly switched web hosts?
Posted by phil09 on 04-9-2006 5:06 PM
"Originally posted by Johnny Proctor
Today the site came back up with everyone's stats on zero. I have no idea what is going on. Where's the intel?"

hi guys,
as i understand it, they got hacked again and crashed for the third time in a month, only this time the damage was more invasisve, it appears that they lost much of their original stats, that's the buzz within the N1M forum, in which i'm 'personna non grata' for exposing the emperor's nakedness
Posted by Johnny Proctor on 04-9-2006 8:14 PM
I couldn't find one word in their forums that would even leave you the impression that anything was wrong. It appears that as soon as a negative comment appears, it gets 86ed. Maybe they do have a new server host, but that says nothing about the scam generic reviews and phantom mailing list subscribers.
Posted by phil09 on 05-9-2006 4:55 PM
Quote:

Originally posted by Johnny ProctorI couldn't find one word in their forums that would even leave you the impression that anything was wrong.  It appears that as soon as a negative comment appears, it gets 86ed.  Maybe they do have a new server host, but that says nothing about the scam generic reviews and phantom mailing list subscribers.


shame we didn't get together on the inside, been advising a number of N1M artists to get out, stay out and get their cash back, following the Stoneman's lead
i also had trouble finding threads at N1M, but imagined it was the loss of data due to hacking...
but given the rest of the info available, your probably right that dissent is crushed in "1984" Big Brother style

2+2=5
Posted by Johnny Proctor on 05-9-2006 9:19 PM
That would have been for the best, Phil, but I still wish we had the smoking gun. I mean, we have plenty of circumstantial evidence, but its like the girl who thinks her thug boyfriend really likes her because she's so happy that someone has finally paid attention to her. People just don't want to believe all those hundreds of adoring fans aren't real. And that's what's so despicable about their scam - they are exploiting peoples' dreams. That's evil.
Posted by Datryfe mc on 06-9-2006 3:16 PM
I got an email from N1M. Did anyone else get it. It came Sept. 5th.
Posted by Datryfe mc on 09-9-2006 7:11 PM
Its crazy - we got over 140.000 plays - 400 signups. 60 replys to emails we sent out. Two of them were duplicates. (guy called our music 'delicious' - lol) In 5 months. - We ask our signees to check out our myspace page where they can see our video and got no where near the stats on N1M.


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